BEST SITE to read about goings on in CATHOLIC CHURCH in Ireland and worldwide

by John Doe - Irish Catholic Thu Oct 23, 2008 17:18

Just checked out the site that has been recommended and lo and behold found a VERY interesting posting that should be of interest to those in the gay community as well as those within (or without) the church.

Check out this interesting link below.

The FINANCIAL mention makes interesting reading - by john joe our contributions on da plate are disappearing into thin air faster than we can say abrakadabra and now da boys in blue are being called in to try and trace it and these guys have more to be doing tracking down da real hardened criminals rather than trying to track money that has gone 'walkabout' in local Churches by those 'possibly' part of the Church itself it would seem. (Of course innocent until proven guilty!)

Think it is time that the real credit crunch hit the Church and we cut back on our contributions?

by John Doe Thu Oct 23, 2008 17:27

Boys oh boys things are hotting up on the northside with estimates of 14k a year vanishing into thin air from one northside parish.

Makes you lucky to know you are a southsider and maybe things are not Q U I T E as bad with us YET.

Good to know I am just a little south of the liffey but shall be watching where I put my small change from now on "just in case".

by Aoife and Sinead - World Youth Day Participants 2008 Fri Oct 24, 2008 08:36

We had a great time at World Youth Day in Australia earlier this year.

We were at the Pope's Mass but we never got to view the Papal Secretary until we returned home and saw this on U Tube and now on the Clerical Whispers site.

Ladies or Gentlemen it is worth a viewing at the link we are giving you. (You must have sound to enjoy it).

Who says the Church is dull? This will lift the "SPIRITS".

by A concerned citizen Sat Nov 01, 2008 18:11

Isn't it time the Government here did something about the knife crime on our streets. Every day we have stabbings and death. How many deaths does it take for them to wake up and DO SOMETHING? Law and order has broken down in Ireland. The Department of Justice is a sham and the Prisons are not having the money spent on them to actually put the criminals in prison and leave them there to serve their full sentence so we still have the revolving doors.

It has to be nipped in the bud at teen level with these knife carrying thugs, You can buy lethal knives now not just in sports shops but in every supermarket across the country,

Anyone carrying a knife has ill will towards their fellow man and murder on their minds and if caught with a knife first time should serve at least a year in a special remand centre and 2nd time caught do 5 years there. We are talking about the opening of somehwere like Spike Island or a camp in the Curragh with electrified fences to keep these yobs in and under control. The sentence should be a punishment not a holiday camp so no tv or computers fones and fancy food. It should be turn of the century basic food and accommodation and maybe only cold running water for showers to let the yobs see the poor conditions that half of our world live in and these poor citizens in the Third World don't go out and stab and kill but are grateful just to be alive scratching a living in the dust of their countries.

The spoilt yobs have taken over our country and are out of control. Their parents don't care and in many cases are even afraid of their own sons so say nothing. The Police don't care because why should they risk their lives and leave their children fatherless for the yobs to be back on the street within the hour etc. etc.

We should be walking the streets of our cities and protesting about the lack of law and order in our country and the fact that the Government have lost control of the situation.

We need the present government out and a government in place who will do something about law and order on our streets. The country is slowly sliding into the gutter with attacks on our firemen ambulances etc. on the streets. Looking at the news you would think the scenes were from Iraq and not Dublin.

Law and order on our streets and people being able to walk safely on them should be a priority.

Link attached should be of interest,

by John Doe Wed Nov 05, 2008 00:33

This is an interesting one about Bishop Willie Walsh and Lying Eyes.

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Sat Nov 08, 2008 17:36

Questioning Catholic and John Doe......Secrecy sure drives underground the Catholic values of the Church.

What disheartens me is that I believed the outing of child sexual abuse, would end rrather than profligate misbehaviours, biases, codes and creeds based on power and supremacy, and like we expect from our Political representatives, the Church would be a humanitarian, transparent, ethical body.

I will not say too much because this site..,... Clerical Whispers ought to be read by all people in Ireland so that they can fully appreciate what being Catholic really means.

Has anyone ever thought why nearly all our churches in the cities are closed in the evenings. Austria is quite different. Evenings, churches are open and all kinds of people drift in and out and light candles. These Churches are adormed and humble people to the centuries past.

I do not wish to take away from the apparent and kind works of the Capuchins, the Franciscans, and nuns too but these are consistent with the Plain People of Ireland, their beliefs, their shares compassion.

Another breed of Church is out there on the horizon. This is the Corporate Church.....the Church that focuses on the future, education in profitable fields such as medicine, law, finance is provide for, in tailored invitators to Mansion Houses now converted throughout Ireland. They provide services of care to the elderly....highly organised, and highly profitable and it goes without saying it targets the young, by providing Residences at the leading universitie. This is an international group. Opus Dei has been the target of much commented regarding Tara Hill, the Skryne Gabhra Valley but like the Columban Fathers, they have kept a low profile with little media attention and I would suggest their programmes receive funding from the Department of Education and other bodies.

It looks like our Chuch has gone two track.....or two tier. If you accept this, that is okay but remember the Church belongs to each member.......

Yesterday, walking down Wellington Road, with auburn leaves blowing in the wind, the sky blue and autumn at full throttle, my partner said hello to this man, working landscape and somehow the conversatin came round to Opus Dei.....we were talking about the recession and the good payer to the ordinary workman. The man had experience working for one of these bad payers, he needed is weekly wage but the cheque was not forthcoming because finances had not been cleared at the Vatican. This always concerns me when I consider the amount property sold by the Church in Ireland to the Celtic Tiger cats......I read that book some 20 years ago about Calvi hung from a bridge, Marcinkus, the Vatican City, which had the status as a separate state. I often wonder where the true profits of the Church in Ireland are banked? In the UK, the Govt, pledge to the Banks has revealed the weakness of greed in people. The greed gave them amnesia and people with Isle of Man accounts applied to the Banks for compensation forgetting they were customers of with tax havens in the Isle of Man - the Irish Sea.........

Our gardener friend called after us. He said but you must know that your neighbouring parish - St. Vincents Hospital is now an Opus Dei parrish

Note the article on Clerical Whispers site. Apparently on 31st October in Spanish, Ete made an attach on an Opus Dei church in Spain...........................there is such quietude.

The book I remember the name 'In God's Name'.......what an investigation.....? Author David Yallop

ps Books....if you are going to Starbucks, their Christmas initiative is to encourage reading so they are a collection point............

by A Question Catholic waiting for change Sat Nov 08, 2008 18:50

Michelle thank you for your contribution.

I started this listing having worked for the Church as a non religious and having got to see from the inside that it has mainly become a hard nosed business. Money talks. If you are an ordinary Joe Soap the Parish Priest does not want to know you BUT if you have money, power, connections he latches on to you as a Best Friend and uses you to network his way around gaining more power and money and glory for himself. That new friend then goes on to be a member of the Parish Council and one of the favoured few of the Parish Priest so that there is NO DEMOCRACY in the Parish Council as ALL those on it are hand picked YES men and women to approve any new 'scheme' the Parish Priest has in his Parish and he knows he can have instant approval and issue the new directives to the Parish not solely using his name because he is a coward and does not want people to question his decisions or try to change his mind so the letters going out are signed by the Parish Council and the Reverend man if you can call him that!!!

If you read on the Clerical Whispers site about using psychology to 'weed out' good or bad members to join the Priesthood - some Parish Priests many years after their Ordination take these Psychology courses themselves which come in very useful to manipulate their Parishioners and others they come into contact with.

All Corporations and big businesses have major corruption in them and even leaving aside the child abuse there IS major corruption within the Catholic Church.

Very few Priests now are there for the good of their Parishioners but there are of course the exceptions although on the whole those I have come to know all have an angle like the businessman of 'what is in it for me'.

It is a sad reflection of the way the church has gone but it is now just a career choice for most who join. Years ago when we were children with prayer daily in the home, regular Mass attendance and attendance at Sodality and processions throughout the year if you heard a teenager talking about a calling it would seem natural but now that is gone and it has become just a career choice.

It has been freely admitted even by the Church themselves that there are many homosexual members within the Church so in one way that could have been in the past a reason for a man to join. He had no intention of marrying and having children so in a way he could hide his sexuality by joining the Priesthood because he would not have to produce children as is the norm with other states in Catholic life. People would think of the 'great sacrifice' he was making of giving up having a wife and children when it was the furthest thing from his mind anyway.

Now with this new psychological testing it is very unlikely that any or many homosexuals will in fact be allowed to join the Church in the future so where does that leave them? Some may have a GENUINE calling but they will be one of the DISCRIMINATED within the Church of which there are MANY.

From my personal view I have seen that for many Priests it is considered (if you mainly toe the line within the Church) a job for life, you can expect to be a Parish Priest at around 50 years with your own house which you can have decorated and done up to your hearts content at Parishioners expense unlike the poor Parishioners who cannot even afford the odd coat of paint but you can have it done over when you move in from top to bottom carpets, blinds, curtains, paint, gardens. No worry about the credit crunch here.

You can also spend a fortune on renovations to the inside of the Church THAT PARISHIONERS DO NOT WANT as they are quite happy with what they have and then when you leave the area you also leave the Parish in major debt paying off the unwanted alternations that have been agreed by the YES men and women of the Parish Council and Renovation Committee all hand picked by the Parish Priest to make sure the Plans get the YES.

Sadly this is all happening at a Parish near you. Check out the link

by A Questioning Catholic waiting for change Sat Nov 08, 2008 22:40

The website link below is well worth checking out regarding Church finances.

As we all know money means power and power means money.

The Church has local Parishes raising money non stop, asking us to donate to disasters and the poor and pay for things in our own Parishes. They don't want married Priests because they would then have to support their families like other religious denominations yet they are allowing Anglican married clergy with families move over to the Catholic Church.

Why don't they spend some of their billions, sell some of their art works and treasures in the Vatican and they could help most of the poor and starving in the Third World.

Are they too worried about their stock, shares and other investments losing their value during the current economic recession. In Ireland and other countries they have made a fortune out of selling off schools, convents etc., for new shopping centres and road works yet we hear the endless poor mouth from the Clergy.

If anyone cares to check out the transcript of the Moriarty / Mahon Tribunal on google or indymedia they will see that a Parish Priest on the southside had meetings and phone calls to Frank Dunlop - why should this Priest have been involved in such negotiations??

by John Doe Sun Nov 09, 2008 07:21

Link below to The Flood Tribunal - check out page 2 of same for the Southside PRIEST named twice in the transcript for meeting with and phone calls to Mr. Frank Dunlop regarding the rezoning of land at Quarryvale!!

Why should the Church be tangled in this web???

Was Church land being bought for the development????

by John Doe Sun Nov 09, 2008 21:30

Cardinal Sean Brady does it again - interfering with the love lives of the nation.

The link below is a MUST READ.

by The Sins of the Fathers................................... Sun Nov 09, 2008 21:40

The power of the Church has no bounds.

If you have secrets about members of the Clergy and are going to spill the beans they have the power and the money and the connections with Psychiatrists to have you certified and locked away.

It does not only happen overseas. It HAPPENS in Ireland too.

You have damaging information on member of the Clergy they get a damning evaluation on you to ruin your life bought and paid for by the Church.

Read the link. This Nun 43 years in the Church found out to her cost and another committed suicide earlier.

Power and corruption. The Da Vinci Code did not even touch the tip of the iceberg.

The Irish Catholic Church should come with a Government Health Warning and a big Skull and Crossbones sticker!!!!!!!!!!

Take it from one who knows.

Now check out this link with information.

by A Practising Catholic Tue Nov 11, 2008 21:36

Very interesting link below for an idea taking hold in USA by way of protest to the Church in USA - withholding your donations!!!!!!!!!!!

It makes a lot of sense, if you are not satisfied with their performance hit them where it hurts in their pockets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The laity are all suffering badly in the credit crunch so it is only fair the Church have their share as they are not short of the few bob by all reports.

One Parish on the Southside seems to have got this message a couple of years ago with the Outdoor collection dropping and dropping............they were not satisfied with the goings on of the Parish Priest so this is the way they are protesting hitting the Parish in its pocket and in the 3 times yearly Dues.

Good on them.

Maybe Archbishop Diarmuid Martin will eventually wake up and get the message as to what is going on and do SOMETHING about the Parish Priest.

Now check out the link for your information....

by Not the marrying kind - Singletons living together and happy Wed Nov 12, 2008 19:44

If and when the law is changed couples will marry for the right reasons and won't feel under pressure to do so because of financial and inheritance problems that may occur in the future when they don't seriously want to make the 'Church' commitment.

Good link attached on the subject

by Concerned Catholic Fri Nov 14, 2008 00:37

The link below should be followed and item read regarding abuse within the Church.

by Equal Rights for All Mon Nov 17, 2008 20:23

The very out of touch with the people of Ireland Cardinal Sean Brady's recent comments can be seen at the link below.

Nobody in Ireland wants to return to the Dark Ages when the Catholic Church ruled our lives and went to bed with us!!!

by Equal Rights for All Mon Nov 17, 2008 23:56

Seems although it is known that between 25%-50% of present day Catholic Clergy world wide are homosexual nowadays those you are thinking of applying to become a member of the Priesthood "need not apply" as there are psychologists employed to "weed out" these men during their early days in the Seminaries.

Check out the link below with details of this from the Vatican which has been approved and passed by Pope Benedict.

by Alan Corcoran - none Mon Nov 17, 2008 23:59

A recent report suggests the church is seeking Polish Priests for to join the Dublin Diocese due to lack of home grown ''talent''.
Information also suggests the Catholic Church are keen to entice Nigerian priests ( SAME PROBLEM )

Perhaps Our Lady Queen Of Peace ,Bray Co. Wicklow may be in line to take advantage of any opportunity which may present itself in this field
as above Church is at present Parish Priestless as the last one left in a hurry ,citing from the pulpit the fact that the former parish priest was ILL.

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Tue Nov 18, 2008 15:19

Alan.

I had thought over the last number years, the Church was seeking priests from other countries, to man our system of parishes, as in place from Famine times when the impoverished and starving of the time were only to willing to contribute alms, if the truth be none to grant them peace.

The Churches, the parochial houses, the monasteries, the missions all indicate that poverty built what represented visually the Roman Catholic Church in Ireland. It is this we the people have inherited through the management of Bishops and their links no doubt with the Vatican City in Rome.

Opus Dei, like the Polish priests, the priests from the African continent, have identified a market in Ireland and its dwindling presence in the diocese, in education, in parishes.

The big move has happened. It is strategic, profound, and subtle.

Merrion parish has recently been assigned by the Archbishop Martin (?), with his support. This is a prime parish given its location in Dublin 4, with St. Vincent's Hospital and nursing homes, and academic campuses all within easy access.

Ireland is a democracy. I question this decision about Opus Dei.....Is this democratic? The funds came from the people of Ireland and the lands were often donated by the gentry e.g. Kinvara school, so this money is entrusted to the Catholic Church in a democratic way for the benefit of the people. This does not provide for selective organisations
like Opus Dei. The Church too must be Transparent, Ethical, Accountable to the Island of Ireland, particularly as the market's hit rock bottom and times bode poverty again. Why are the churches in the City closed and not used for the homeless and others.........Morally this is wrong while other's attend elitist privileged lectures.

Alan: I wonder what you think about this. Opus Dei have fine properties around Ireland. In Galway one of the houses is Ballyglunin (this was in the Blake family for 200 years), Lismullin in Co. Meath (Tara, Gabhra Skryne) again was a gentry house, the Dillons...... Tara is a disgrace to Ireland at all levels yet people from all over the world, from academics to artists, to try and make Tara a worldwide heritage site. Yet, it was foiled by the elite in Ireland or should I say those that Anti Corruption legislation will find in time and prosecute.

Michelle

Quotations
Beliefs Cesar Chavez (1927-1993) Labor Leader

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Wed Nov 19, 2008 19:26

Just look at the cover and you will know there is lots to keep you smiling - exceptional caricature.

This year there is a surprise, an article on Opus Dei, under the heading 'Affairs of the Nation' (Clerical Errors).

It appears the Archbishop of Dublin Diarmuid. Martin has reached the decision to endorse Opus Dei. The responsibility for running Our Lady Queen of Peace parish in Merrion, Dublin 4 to the 'secretive, ultra conservative religious movement Opus Dei'. (The Phoenix magazine).

This is the first Church in the South or North of Ireland to be operated by the Spanish founded religious body since infiltration into the Land of St. Patrick 61 years ago. Until now, Opus Dei has been involved in exclusive residential centres, adjacent to prominent Universities. People are fearful of Opus Dei mainly based on the book and TV series and the writer's interpretation and research on Opus Dei. (Da Vinci code). The Author, Brown portrayed Opus Day 'as a deeply devout sect', what some of us would regard as a church withiin a church. Practices such as corporal mortification, and brainwashing are practiuces that come to mind.

The social elite in Spain started Opus Dei in 1928 and after the war it wasl aligned with the fascist dominated cabinets assocated with Francesco Franco.....granting it exceptional power worldwide and in the Vatican. Opus Dei run an information office. Opus Dei has a special independenty status recognised by the pope.

Not to spoil the article, I will add two more points:-

It is thought that this organisation has 800 members, some of whom opt for celibacy, in Ireland. 20 are priests of the Holy Cross. 50 + are women who hold equal status with men. Much of their work is in the home arena. The financial worth prior to the Stock Market crash was estimated to be in excess of Euros 100 m. The Irish province of Opus Dei is among the wealthiest globally. Opus assets globally are estimated at US$2.8 billion.

Lismullin Institute is strategically placed to Tara Hill, Gabhra and Skryne. There is little support to the campaigners who are fight the descreaton of ancient sites....druidic, the High Kings of Ireland. It is the development of the motorway that succeeded, even though, there is a strong chance that Tara could be made a worldwide historical site. Is there a paradox, right wing Catholicism and paganism? Do Opus Dei receive funds from the Irish Government for say their catering school at Lismullin or student accommodation at UCD?

Clerical Whispers has proved to be a most interesting site. I wonder if they have a view on Opus Dei and how they view and provide for the mentally ill and vulnerable members of society.

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Wed Nov 19, 2008 19:26

Just look at the cover and you will know there is lots to keep you smiling - exceptional caricature.

This year there is a surprise, an article on Opus Dei, under the heading 'Affairs of the Nation' (Clerical Errors).

It appears the Archbishop of Dublin Diarmuid. Martin has reached the decision to endorse Opus Dei. The responsibility for running Our Lady Queen of Peace parish in Merrion, Dublin 4 to the 'secretive, ultra conservative religious movement Opus Dei'. (The Phoenix magazine).

This is the first Church in the South or North of Ireland to be operated by the Spanish founded religious body since infiltration into the Land of St. Patrick 61 years ago. Until now, Opus Dei has been involved in exclusive residential centres, adjacent to prominent Universities. People are fearful of Opus Dei mainly based on the book and TV series and the writer's interpretation and research on Opus Dei. (Da Vinci code). The Author, Brown portrayed Opus Day 'as a deeply devout sect', what some of us would regard as a church withiin a church. Practices such as corporal mortification, and brainwashing are practiuces that come to mind.

The social elite in Spain started Opus Dei in 1928 and after the war it wasl aligned with the fascist dominated cabinets assocated with Francesco Franco.....granting it exceptional power worldwide and in the Vatican. Opus Dei run an information office. Opus Dei has a special independenty status recognised by the pope.

Not to spoil the article, I will add two more points:-

It is thought that this organisation has 800 members, some of whom opt for celibacy, in Ireland. 20 are priests of the Holy Cross. 50 + are women who hold equal status with men. Much of their work is in the home arena. The financial worth prior to the Stock Market crash was estimated to be in excess of Euros 100 m. The Irish province of Opus Dei is among the wealthiest globally. Opus assets globally are estimated at US$2.8 billion.

Lismullin Institute is strategically placed to Tara Hill, Gabhra and Skryne. There is little support to the campaigners who are fight the descreaton of ancient sites....druidic, the High Kings of Ireland. It is the development of the motorway that succeeded, even though, there is a strong chance that Tara could be made a worldwide historical site. Is there a paradox, right wing Catholicism and paganism? Do Opus Dei receive funds from the Irish Government for say their catering school at Lismullin or student accommodation at UCD?

Clerical Whispers has proved to be a most interesting site. I wonder if they have a view on Opus Dei and how they view and provide for the mentally ill and vulnerable members of society.

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Wed Nov 19, 2008 19:29

Just look at the cover and you will know there is lots to keep you smiling - exceptional caricature.

This year there is a surprise, an article on Opus Dei, under the heading 'Affairs of the Nation' (Clerical Errors).

It appears the Archbishop of Dublin Diarmuid. Martin has reached the decision to endorse Opus Dei. The responsibility for running Our Lady Queen of Peace parish in Merrion, Dublin 4 to the 'secretive, ultra conservative religious movement Opus Dei'. (The Phoenix magazine).

This is the first Church in the South or North of Ireland to be operated by the Spanish founded religious body since infiltration into the Land of St. Patrick 61 years ago. Until now, Opus Dei has been involved in exclusive residential centres, adjacent to prominent Universities. People are fearful of Opus Dei mainly based on the book and TV series and the writer's interpretation and research on Opus Dei. (Da Vinci code). The Author, Brown portrayed Opus Day 'as a deeply devout sect', what some of us would regard as a church withiin a church. Practices such as corporal mortification, and brainwashing are practiuces that come to mind.

The social elite in Spain started Opus Dei in 1928 and after the war it wasl aligned with the fascist dominated cabinets assocated with Francesco Franco.....granting it exceptional power worldwide and in the Vatican. Opus Dei run an information office. Opus Dei has a special independenty status recognised by the pope.

Not to spoil the article, I will add two more points:-

It is thought that this organisation has 800 members, some of whom opt for celibacy, in Ireland. 20 are priests of the Holy Cross. 50 + are women who hold equal status with men. Much of their work is in the home arena. The financial worth prior to the Stock Market crash was estimated to be in excess of Euros 100 m. The Irish province of Opus Dei is among the wealthiest globally. Opus assets globally are estimated at US$2.8 billion.

Lismullin Institute is strategically placed to Tara Hill, Gabhra and Skryne. There is little support to the campaigners who are fight the descreaton of ancient sites....druidic, the High Kings of Ireland. It is the development of the motorway that succeeded, even though, there is a strong chance that Tara could be made a worldwide historical site. Is there a paradox, right wing Catholicism and paganism? Do Opus Dei receive funds from the Irish Government for say their catering school at Lismullin or student accommodation at UCD?

Clerical Whispers has proved to be a most interesting site. I wonder if they have a view on Opus Dei and how they view and provide for the mentally ill and vulnerable members of society.

by A damaged soul still waiting for an apology from the Church Wed Nov 19, 2008 20:26

Please read the attached link. Although it refers to a particular Priest in USA the same has happened in Ireland over and over again. The Bishops and Archbishop just play their own game of "MUSICAL CHAIRS" moving the abusers to another Parish in another area sometimes within Ireland and sometimes sending them off on "Career breaks to study the Gospel that they can already recite backwards". They are sent on these JUNKETS until things quieten down and the heat goes off them and they hope the Parishioners will forget what has happened.

The broken and damaged men women and children they leave in their wake through sexual or mental abuse means the abused will never forget. Their lives have been ruined by the men of the cloth, the Holier than Thou Padres that the Bishops and Archbishops do not have the guts to defrock.

Things will never change within the Church. It is a business where power and money rules. The poor ordinary soul has no chance with these middle men doing their damage and blocking the real way to God with their endless corruption and wrongdoing.

Parish Priests are sent off on GET WELL holidays to let the heat of the embers cool and then we have to take them back and put up with their arrogance and manipulation for another few years in the Parish.

We don't want them back thank you very much. They are neither missed nor wanted.

When will there be transparency and accountability and apologies for the wrong doings of these men of the cloth.

When will Archbishop Diarmuid Martin take off his rose tinted glasses and see them for what they are??

Of course hide it all under the carpet - they don't want to kiss off the cash cow in these guys Parishes by outing the rotten eggs. It would take a Parish a long time to start putting the coins back into the baskets and they cannot risk the loss of income to add to the vast wealth they must sit up all night counting like old Scrooge.

And the Archbishop will say MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL.

Amen.

by A damaged soul still waiting for an apology from the Church Wed Nov 19, 2008 21:11

We all recall the WORDS between Archbishop Diarmuid Martin and the Cardinal who tried to HIDE the files of many Clergy who abused here in Ireland.

Check the link below - it is still happening all over the world especially in USA as this link shows.

Why should they be protected by the Church. Have they learnt NOTHING in the last 50 years.

Many USA Parishes have been almost bankrupted and are selling off property to build up the wealth again.

Had the Bishops not hidden these Priests for half a century the damages bill would not have sky rocketed because they could have put a stop to it.

I guess if they were to DEFROCK all the abusers the Church would have crumbled so they hold on to all the rotten apples.

Surely their crimes done in the name of the Church as they were fully signed and paid up members of the Clergy deserved them being defrocked. If you were a Lawyer or Barrister you would be disbarred in the same situation.

Why has the Catholic Church got such power. When will the people come to their senses and see the Church for what it is.

A corrupt man's institution. No women allowed because they would change things for the better and the good of mankind.

Retire all the red hats in Rome right down to the grass roots and start again.

by Angela Jackson Wed Nov 19, 2008 23:07

On October 30, the Roman Catholic Church issued guidance, approved by Pope Benedict XVI, on how to test whether potential priests have a "positive and stable sense of one's masculine identity."

"In all too many cases, psychological defects, sometimes of a pathological kind, reveal themselves only after ordination to the priesthood," the guidelines say. "Detecting defects earlier would help avoid many tragic experiences."

This would certainly have been the case with a Southside Priest - he decided if you can't beat them join them. Studied psychology and now tries to outfox everyone and stay one step ahead of the pack but his days in the Parish are numbered seeing as he has been AWOL for the last 3+ months.

Check out the very interesting link below to give you a better understanding of the way these guys slipped through the net into the ranks of the Catholic Church and now when the horse has already bolted they are trying to shut the gates.

Well Holy God isn't it about time.

by John Doe Wed Nov 19, 2008 23:38

The link below will make the hairs stand up on the back of your neck when you realise what the Catholic Church in Ireland is capable of.

I have been talking about set ups for years and here is the proof of the pudding.

Do take in the names of the main Characters involved. They are all still alive and well in our Church in Ireland.

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Fri Nov 21, 2008 16:56

What can I say? These are haunting and possibly unanswerable situations, unless there are massive changes to the Organised Catholic Church.
To abuse is unacceptable but it has happened and through the persistence of victims to be heard, it has been outed into the main arena and Abusers are now dealt with by the Judicial system and are humbled and service a number of years in prison. Is the answer? I don't know. I do know that some countries propose far harsher remedies, but we evidently have not had the stomach to take that option.

The Curragh prison some years ago housed a lot of paedophile priests - I think it was there that the infamous Fr. Brendan Smyth died. This man abused children for over 38 years, around Ireland and in America. It was well known in the Church but kept secret. Let us not forget he brought down Albert Reynolds Government in the 1990's. Truth is the objective but sometimes social relations can only work if lies about.

Clerical Whispers is a wealth of material relating to the Catholic Chuch that exists for people to start thinking about the position of the Catholic Church in the Island of Ireland. Times have changed and there are several denominations now and then of course, there is the new dimension, Opus Dei and its repositioning into parish work, sanctioned by Archbishop Diarmuid Martin. The location is prime. It is Merrion beside St. Vincents Hospital (I would think there is an elderly population in this area). This man has spent many years in Rome working within Vatican Citry also.

Clerical Whispers portray three words in latin, that form the basis of humanity and its interaction.

Fides is about Trust. If so, why not pass on abuse files to those best able to deal with them.

Libertas. Freedom. Is their freedom for the married couple, and one has the affair, the other is in poor health, and the new family have allegiances to a far right privileged section of the Church and thereby supersede the ordinary conditions for annulment and proceed with an annulment irrespective.

Veritas is about Truth. What can I say? Each human being must look to their heart and soul and form a decision about Truth.

.
I would recommend the article about the Vatical and their over-indulgence with Incentive Pay. This is a large bureaucracy with many staff who clock in and who are paid in relation to performance. Now who does this resemble.......yes, our Government.

Again I will ask the question. Ireland, from All Hallows, to Lismullin, to Christ Church etc.......what happens when an Order like the Loretto nuns sell the convent in a prime city in Ireland. Is the money invested in the banks or does it return to Vatican City.

Michelle

Quotation
Change
'You have to be the change you want to see in the world
Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948) Indian Independence leader, lawyer and Pacifist

by A Catholic - a vanishing breed Fri Nov 21, 2008 17:48

Below is link to the new rules of the Vatican where all staff will have to clock in and be paid according to their work performance.

Has the credit crunch hit the Vatican with some of their invested BILLIONS losing value so they have to cut down on the CENTS they are paying the Red Hatted ones?

What about the Parish Priests in Ireland and there are some who have an easy job for life with Parish house all to themselves that used to house several priests but these men want PRIVACY for their PRIVATE LIVES therefore they don't want anyone living in to watch them coming and going and who comes and goes with them (and often stays overnight). On other occasions PP stays out on the tiles in city and burglar alarm goes off security company rings but nobody home to turn it off.

What happens to the clocking in and out of these HOLY MEN who have free rein to do as they please and con their Parishioners.

There is such a Parish on the south side of Dublin where these goings on are well documented and Archbishop Diarmuid Martin knows ALL about it but does NOTHING.

The Parishioners are just suckers funding the lifestyle of this PP to swan around. Why is he not dumped by the Church. Who is there to see he does his work or clocks in.

Some cannot understand why there are not lines of men waiting to sign up to become Priests - the easy life your home and everything else taken care of. You also acquire a good standing in the town you live in because you are a Priest (although the odd time this good standing has not been earned or deserved).

Maybe they are just starting at the Vatican that staff will be held accountable in the Church - how many years will it take for this system to trickle down to the Parishes around the world. Me thinks most of the rotten eggs of today will be pushing up the daisies before it becomes relevant in our Parishes.

What a shame.

There is no truth, no justice, no transparency in the Irish Church. Just one cover up after another. Just hiding one Priest after another until the heat goes off them. Moving them around like musical chairs but it is time the music stopped.

by A Catholic - a vanishing breed Fri Nov 21, 2008 19:00

Now that Frank Dunlop has been charged will the Parish Priest now based in the Southside have to go forward and answer questions as to what he as a Priest was doing meeting Frank Dunlop regarding rezoning of Quarryvale while he was based at a Church in the area. The link below names the Priest and states that Mr. Dunlop confirmed in questioning that he had meetings with this Priest and phone calls from him.

If you google the flood tribunal for the Independent Newspapers in depth 2000 special on the Quarryvale Rezoning you will also find a letter from this Priest and another Parish Priest to the Dublin Councillors lobbying them to change their vote for the rezoning. The details also says local clergy had been lobbying.

Why were local Clergy and the Catholic Church getting involved in these dealings. Would it make their Church land more valuable? Were they taking payoffs if the zoning went through WITH THEIR HELP?, did they sell land to the new development?

Is there a COVER UP because they are The Catholic Church in Ireland like the abuse cover ups.

Where are the answers and the transparency??????

Those who now have to PUT UP WITH this Parish Priest running their southside Parish want answers NOW.

by Michael. - Human League Fri Nov 21, 2008 19:55

As the 'oul intro suggests and to go one further the Church Of Our Lady Queen Of Peace ,Putland Road Bray ,County Wicklow ,Is Now Offering
A special Radio to be installed in parishioners homes @ 25euros Per Pop ,.

At least the 'oul radio wont be faced with the old tried and trusted ,''Where the effen hell were you last nite and the nite before etc.''

If ya cant beat the parishioners to the church then Haunt Them Over The Airwaves and watch the direct debits flow...............

by John Doe Fri Nov 21, 2008 20:28

Seems the Vatican will not get its way in Brazil. See the link below stating what they ask is illegal.

The new laws the Vatican passed requiring Psychologists to weed out homosexuals they do not want in the Church are now illegal under the laws of Brazil.

Isn't it about time the Catholic Church was put in its place and the law of the land overruled it.

It is time it happened here in Ireland too. (And Pigs will fly!!!)

by Elvis - Cloud 9 Fri Nov 21, 2008 21:04

''Tip Toe Through The Tulips'' ,origionly recorded bi Tiny Tim Is an all time favourite with the Clergy .

by Confused Catholic Sat Nov 22, 2008 23:33

Very interesting link below about high profile Catholics who make public their views on picking and choosing the parts of Catholic teaching they will follow. Writer says they are not excommunicated because if all those who hold similar belief's were to be excommunicated there would be very few Catholics left in the world.

This link also explains how modern Popes including Benedict have disagreed with earlier Pope's teachings. Interesting don't you think? Are the modern Pope's also a la carte Catholics?

by A Pilgrim Sun Nov 23, 2008 20:37

It was frightening to read that so many people who went on Pilgrimage this year to Lourdes were struck down by a serious virus on their return home after an incubation period.

More information in the link below.

by Anti Corruption Mon Nov 24, 2008 13:25

Below is link to Irish Independent newspapers special on the Tribunal involving Frank Dunlop and Dublin City Councillors. If you scroll down you will see letter sent by 2 Dublin based Priests (one now residing in a Parish on the Southside) to the Dublin Councillors before their vote.

In another part it says that there was heavy lobbying by Clergy in the area!!

Why were the Clergy not interviewed during the Tribunal and what they were up to published in the papers like the information on all the others questioned?

Did the Catholic Church work another cover up???

They are experts at sweeping problems under the carpet along with the poor souls that have been used and abused by them.

When will they get their comeuppance and be held accountable? Ah sure this Southside Parish Priest announced from the Altar during Mass before the collection baskets went around not to worry your money is not paying my legal fees but our Insurance Company are covering them. BUT THE PARISHIONERS MONEY IN THE BASKET FOR THE DAY TO DAY RUNNING OF THE PARISH PAY THE INSURANCE PREMIUMS - SO SAME THING.

This link is very relevant to SOME of the goings on of this Priest.

by Anti Corruption Tue Nov 25, 2008 19:19

You may have read the Transcript of the Flood Tribunal or the Independent Newspapers special on the Tribunal etc. regarding the Southside Parish Priest and Frank Dunlop - links to both in postings above this.

The link below UNMASKS the Priest!!

by A Catholic - a vanishing breed Thu Nov 27, 2008 20:57

Credit crunch finally hits Dublin Diocese according to His Grace Archbishop Diarmuid Martin.

Link below gives further details.

Comment at the end of the item gives a very good suggestion as to how he can certainly save some of the Euros!!!

by Anti Corruption - Freedom to work in porn free environment Mon Dec 01, 2008 02:56

We are hearing a lot about FAS and its finances on the news.

For news on a different angle regarding FAS and the Church check out the link below.

by A Questioning Catholic waiting for change Wed Dec 03, 2008 23:40

Discrimination is alive and well in all areas of life.

One would not expect it in your neighbourhood Catholic Church but you will find it there ALIVE AND WELL.

Hopefully those attending Church services there will be equally discriminating and give their cash to more worthy causes this Christmas and not fatten the wallet of the Parish Priest with Christmas Dues.

Do check out the link.

by Queen of Peace Parishioner Fri Dec 05, 2008 18:51

Seems the season of goodwill is not alive and well in some Parishes around the country which is a very sad situation.

More information at the link below.

Here's hoping 2009 will bring better things for all concerned.